Welcome to the PT Rebels Podcast. This is the place to learn how you can become a PT rebel and take charge of your own health and wellness. We will help you find answers to your questions about pain, injury, and the path towards healing in the most efficient and effective way possible. I’m your host, Dr. Gina Fick.
On today’s episode, I’d like to step into the heart and mind of a former division one collegiate athlete and gain perspective on what it means to be a champion, what it means to have a mind of a champion, and how you can overcome challenges and obstacles. As a high level athlete, we will dive into what it means for an athlete to face challenges and obstacles such as season ending injuries and strive to better understand how physical therapy and sports psychology can help athletes overcome obstacles and setbacks.
I’d like to welcome my good friend Andrea Willis to the podcast. Andrea is currently a third year DPT student at Emory University in Atlanta, Georgia, and she just finished a clinical rotation with Fick Physical Therapy and Sports Performance in August. Andrea has a bachelor’s degree in exercise science with a minor in psychology. She also has a master’s degree in sports psychology. Welcome, Andrea to the podcast.
Andrea: Hi Gina. Thank you so much for having me.
Dr. Fick: You’re welcome. It’s a pleasure and an honor to have you. Just to give you guys a little bit of background, Andrea is the Colorado all-time State record holder in the Pole Vault and holds three state Colorado titles in the pole vault from 2014 to 2016. Andrea attended the University of Kansas on scholarship as a D one track and field athlete with her background as a state champion, division one athlete, and now soon to be a physical therapist with a background in sports psychology. Andrea brings a unique perspective and look into the challenges that athletes face and how physical therapists can help them work through those challenges. Andrea, I have a few questions for you today. First of all, can you tell us a little bit more about yourself, your background and how you got to the place that you are now?
Andrea: Yeah, of course. I grew up in Colorado Springs. My family is Air Force, so I moved around a little bit, but I call Colorado Springs home. I grew up doing a variety of sports and was a long time gymnast actually, and then started pole vaulting my sophomore year of high school. And was really blessed to take off really well with that and be really successful in that. And then, yeah, pole vaulting was really fun and awesome, and then really wanted to do sports medicine as a career after I was done with my athletic career and ran into a few roadblocks while I was an athlete at Kansas and just have grown and learned so much through that whole process and ended up pursuing physical therapy.
Dr. Fick: That’s fantastic. Can you tell us about the injuries that you experienced at the collegiate level at University of Kansas as a pole vaulter?
Andrea: Yeah, of course. I had plantar fasciitis to begin with and I thought it was just plantar fasciitis for a long time and did really high level training and competed a whole season on this injury and it ended up turning into a plantar fascia tear. I fractured my heel and then I also tore another muscle in the bottom of my foot. And then also had some further complications down the road after figuring out what all was going on there.
Dr. Fick: So how long was it of a process? Was it from the time that you first started having pain until you actually received the diagnosis that gave you more clarity about the extent of your injury? How long of a process was that for you?
Andrea: Oh gosh. So it was early fall of, let me think, 2018 and then did all of fall training on it and then all of the indoor season. And I was talking with medical staff. They thought that it was appropriate to wait until the end of season to get it checked out. So I think it was probably about nine months until we originally got it checked out. And then the whole healing process really kind of took, I mean, it was over a year after that, so probably almost two years kind of dealing with this nagging injury.
Dr. Fick: Wow. That’s a really long time to endure that type of injury. And the frustrations must have been pretty significant at times. Can you tell us more about just the frustrations that you experienced as you tried to work through this injury and maybe some of the challenges that you’ve had because of this nature of the chronic injury and not being able to get clear answers for a while, like can you go into a little bit more detail about that?
Andrea: Yeah, for sure. As a high level athlete and having invested so much time, money, energy, me, not only me, but my family as well into this sport and getting to such a high level and being really successful, I competed at NCAA Division one NCAAs on this injury and going through all of this and having the news that this is what’s wrong. I understood that injuries and sometimes very serious injuries happen in sports, and they really do. And I think what the most unexpected frustration was is that it was originally a misdiagnosis. And so I know that injuries also heal. And so I was expecting the healing process to take weeks or months, not months or years. And what was frustrating about that is when you put so much of this time and energy into a sport and you get injured, your identity as an athlete starts to fall apart. And it starts to not only just affect you physically, but mentally and spiritually as well. And that was a part that I really didn’t expect throughout the entire journey.
I could handle the physical pain, but when it came to the emotional pain associated with the injury, it was something that I had never experienced before and I had to seek help in different areas that I wasn’t necessarily comfortable or experienced doing. And I had to kind of surrender to me thinking that I could fix everything and me thinking that I could get better because this was an injury that was very complex and it was very hard to heal. As I was saying, there was a misdiagnosis. They didn’t diagnose the fracture right away. And so, the prognosis on the healing was just taking such a long time and I was trusting these really high level doctors as they’re very intelligent and very smart and very experienced. But I think we have to realize that medicine is a practice and it’s not necessarily the end all be all, and it can be for a lot of people. But I think what I realized during that injury is that sometimes things in life just aren’t gonna go your way and they aren’t gonna get fixed. And that was something that I hadn’t really experienced before because I’m a very hard worker. I couldn’t just work my way out of not being injured. And so, it just took a lot of humbling and a lot of reaching out for help and it was a lot of frustration, but through the Lord’s guidance, I was able to get through it. So really grateful for that.
Dr. Fick: What a unique story and perspective that you have on your injury. I think, you know, as you’re soon to be a physical therapist, that plays so much into building the person and the physical therapist that you are soon to become. And I personally just really appreciate that perspective that you have because not everyone has that perspective, not only as an athlete, but a physical therapist. Can you speak more to the role that physical therapy and athletic training played in your recovery process at the University of Kansas? What did your recovery and physical therapy journey look like specifically? Like how many times a day or how many times a week, or how long did that go for? Or what types of things did you do in physical therapy or in the athletic training room?
Andrea: Yeah. First you just want to say thank you for the kind words that was very sweet of you. And then when it comes to recovery. I was actually doing recovery throughout all of fall training and all of the indoor season. I was probably in the training room probably for an hour or two each day getting maintenance such as soft tissue massage or various modalities. I had some exercises that I was doing or dry needling, things like that to kind of manage the pain. But it got to a point at the end of the season where pretty much everything I did besides medication would make it worse. So anything that was hands-on would kind of flare my foot up. So that was pretty frustrating.
So then, once we kind of figured out what was going wrong, I originally was put in a walking boot to help heal the plantar fascia, but it actually made it worse because of that heel stress fracture. So when it came to rehab afterwards, from the very beginning, once they found out what was really going on, it was a lot of passive modalities. So really just electrodes like pain modalities, things like that. Long tissue laser, a little bit of light massage and some like really easy range of motion in my ankle. Other, that was kind of how rehab went for months, honestly, and was kind of frustrating because at first I was still weight-bearing through the foot. With that heel stress fracture, the doctor informed me that I needed to be non-weight-bearing for 12 weeks. So at the very beginning of the injury when I was still weight-bearing, I would go from bearing just because I couldn’t tolerate all the weight through my heel. I go from non-weight bearing to a walking progression.
So as I got into that walking progression, it was trying to load the foot back up, but it would constantly get flared up over and over and over again. And it was just painful and there, and I wasn’t seeing any progress. So then that whole summer of 2019, I was non-weightbearing and I finally was experiencing some relief in my heel pain. And so then once I went to visit, and then after that, my physical therapy kind of ramped up and so kind of worked on slow progression to weightbearing. So I did a lot of things on like a sled. I did like some squats and we had to do a lot of modifications just because the original pain in my heel felt like there was a knife going through my foot. That’s like the best way that I could describe it. And so when I was doing like these shuttle squats, we would have to put a soft pad, like an airex pad underneath my feet in order for me to be able to tolerate any kind of weight through my foot.
It was a lot of easy range of motion just because I was non-weight bearing and immobilized for so long that I lost a little bit of strength. And then to back up just a little bit before I got back into weight bearing, I did a lot of BFR training. That’s kind of how I kept up my strength and so some of you listening on this podcast may know or may have experienced some BFR and that was super, super helpful in me maintaining my hip strength and my quad strength and my hamstring strength and even in my lower legs. And was really lucky that Kansas had that resource in order for me to continue building, I mean maintaining, and then honestly building that strength. So once I got into weight bearing again, the weakest part was really my lower leg and my foot, my hips, and my quads. We did some muscle strength testing and I actually was within 20% like the leg, which is pretty impressive considering how long I was non-weightbearing.
So physical therapy was twice a week. And then I would do strength training the other, like the opposite days of the week. So I would do weightlifting four times a week in physical therapy two times a week and then take a day off. And, because of the irritability and because of the complexity of the injury, my strength conditioning as well as my track and field coach and my physical therapist and my athletic trainer all had to collaborate on what we were doing in order to make my foot better. So, yeah, it was a complex and long process for sure.
Dr. Fick: That is incredible. Just the complexity and the patience during that process must have been very challenging, and it just speaks to your character, what you were able to persevere through. And I know that it wasn’t always easy at all. So, you know, I wondered how did this experience help shape you and your view of physical therapy and the goals of one day wanting to become a physical therapist?
Andrea: Yeah, of course. So while I had this injury, or while I was going through college, before I got injured, I actually wanted to pursue professional track and field and that was kind of my goal. And I was an exercise science major, and that was in the school of Education at the University of Kansas. So I was thinking of going actually more the education route. It wasn’t until my last year of my undergraduate degree in the fall, I actually was seeing a sports psychologist through the university, through the University of Kansas, Dr. Mary Fry, and was working really closely with her just because of the mental and psychological aspect of this injury because it started to take such a toll on me. And so, after going to Mary Fry two times a week, and we built a really good relationship and I started to develop a passion for helping people through their mind.
Pole vaulting in and of itself is a very mental sport and has to be very mentally tough to be successful in the sport, and I started to realize that using sports psychology to enhance sport performance was very beneficial. And then as I experienced this injury, being able to change my thoughts and frame my thoughts in a different way, and using techniques such as imagery, journaling, biofeedback, all were very transitional in my recovery. They really helped my mind because I really do believe that what you think in your mind and what you do in your mind determines everything that your body does, and if you don’t have a healthy mind throughout the entire process, you’re not gonna recover very well.
And so honestly, my relationship and my experience with Dr. Mary Fry transitioned me into my master’s degree at the University of Kansas. And she was actually my graduate school advisor. And so I was really blessed to have that relationship. And I just think everything happens for a reason. And I was put in that position for a reason to have this unique perspective and this unique lens on what it looks like for athletes to recover from injuries. And it wasn’t actually until after I had started my master’s degree in sports psychology that I felt that I was missing a little bit of a piece of my passion for injuries and my passion for athletes. Not that it wasn’t there in sports psychology, but I’m a very kinesthetic, hands-on learner and I really felt that I was being called to help people not only mentally, but also physically and spiritually as well.
So something that I really am trying to create and really trying to work on every single day is who I am as a medical provider will be healing through the mind, body, and spirit, healing these people as a whole, not necessarily just through one aspect. And so I’m just really grateful for the tools and the experience that I have, and the people and the mentors along the way who have led me to where I’m at now.
Dr. Fick: That’s awesome. Just a great story of your background and passion and how that’s led you to the point that you are now. I had a question for you. At what point do you think an athlete should seek help from a sports psychologist or counselor when they’re facing tough moments or challenges in life or when they are dealing with recovery from injury that is becoming a more chronic process?
Andrea: For sure. I think any injury, looking back on this entire process, any injury that is going to take an extended amount of time and any injury that is going to take an athlete out of their field of play and away from their teammates is the point where I think sports psychology can be really, really beneficial. I think one of the first things that any athlete can attest to for being injured is really being away from their teammates. Not being a part of the group, or not being a part of the team or having to have a modified workout because part of being an athlete is having those people around you to support you and having, I don’t know, kind of being part of a group and feeling the sense of belonging. And so once you lose that, you kind of feel these, you kind of experience these feelings of worthlessness or you feel left out. Or you’re not good enough, or you failed in a way.
And then also at the division one level, there’s a lot of pressure to compete, and so there’s a lot of pressure to compete, but there’s also a lot of pressure to perform. And so I think that there’s a lot of stress that’s inflicted onto the athlete that nobody necessarily talks about, but it’s kind of this unspoken thing that I’ve talked to a lot of athletes about, a lot of athletes who actually experience career ending injuries, and they all say the same thing. Is that you just lack this sense of belonging and you lack this sense of purpose when you get this injury. And so, again, going to a sports psychologist and learning how to reframe your thought and learning how to push out those negative emotions and express gratitude to the people around you, and really just create this environment for yourself that is about enjoying your sport rather than having it be all about performance because at the end of the day, the nature of sport and the nature of what physical activity is supposed to do is it’s supposed to keep us healthy and it’s supposed to bring us joy. And so when we get to the point where it defines every aspect of our lives, we have something like an injury or a career ending injury come along, and it can destroy an athlete, really from the inside out without anybody ever knowing. So not only taking care of your body, but also taking care of your mind is gonna ensure proper and full recovery.
Dr. Fick: That’s great advice for athletes. One question I have for you as well as healthcare providers or physical therapists, what are some of the key signs that we can look for in our athletes that we are treating to be able to recognize those signs and when it’s time to refer out to a sports psychologist? What are the signs and key things that we should be looking for in our athletes day to day, week to week, and refer?
Andrea: Yeah, for sure. I think really asking subjective questions, so really even when it is medical screening, asking these athletes if they’re down depressed or hopeless, or if they’re feeling less joy in life, or they’re feeling off or they’re not feeling themselves. Those are some questions that can be really beneficial and really key to referring out to a sports psychologist because those simple questions, not feeling like yourself, feeling down, depressed. Those things are very key for an athlete to recovery because if you do have these things going on in your mind, they’re going to affect physically how we can heal. And so as healthcare providers, we want to, especially these really high level athletes who are needing to get back to their sports quickly and safely and efficiently, we need to be able to treat them from a variety of lenses.
And so, we actually, I just had a medical screening class on Monday and so asking those two questions I think is like 93% successful in screening for really important aspects of mental, further mental health issues. And so I think also too, as athletes, a lot of times we try to be the tough guy and we try to say that everything’s okay and we say that doesn’t hurt, or we say that we’re fine and it’s not necessarily to reveal weaknesses in an athlete, but it’s just help you just to really help you get back and get healthy. I mean, that’s at least my perspective is that’s all I want you to do. I’m not trying to ask these questions to expose something about you. It really is just to make you the very best and most successful person that you can be.
Dr. Fick: If you had to go back and do anything differently in the way that you worked through or handled your injury, what would you change and what would you tell your younger self?
Andrea: Yeah. I think in a way, going off of what I was just discussing, I would humble myself and just have a little bit of surrender and knowing that I can’t fix it all and sometimes it’s not okay. And it is okay to reach out and get help and have the resources in order to be healthy. I think there is an aspect and there’s an element of being tough in sports, but I think there’s a lot of power in exposing the things that are going wrong because everyone around you, I mean, what I noticed at Kansas is I feel like I maybe reached out a little bit too late when it came to the mental aspect of things, and also I’m a strong Christian, and I think in my spiritual life too. I think my surrender to the Lord and this whole process and knowing that he was gonna take care of me and that he had this all planned out for the better and for good. That my surrender spiritually and my trust in God’s plan for me as well, happened a little bit too late. And so I think once those two things happened, once I really reached out for help and once I really started to trust the process, I think my mind and my spirit started to improve and I started to be healthier, which then yielded a lot more success in my physical recovery.
Dr. Fick: I think you alluded to it with the last question, but what do you think are the key character traits for a high school athlete who aspires to be at the collegiate level or division one level as a collegiate athlete. And what do you see as some of the key character components and traits for a successful athlete?
Andrea: Yeah. What first comes to mind to me is courage. I think we can see courage as being the courage to try new things or to try something difficult, but also the courage to say something when something’s wrong. And I would also say humility is very important and really just hard work and perseverance. I would say those would be the main things that come to mind initially. But I think the most important part is that different perspective on courage and not always the courage to try something new, but humble yourself and to really get the help you need when you need it.
Dr. Fick: I think that you were able to demonstrate a lot of these key things as far as character traits in your own life. And I’m just curious, how do you think that those traits now have been able to carry you through physical therapy school and to the point where you’re soon to graduate and be a physical therapist yourself?
Andrea: Yeah, so physical therapy school is not easy. And a lot of persistence and perseverance is key to success as I felt even in physical therapy school, some burnout. And I think just continuing to push through and knowing that there is a lot at the end of the tunnel and doing your best is important. And then also with courage and humility, knowing that it’s okay to not be perfect all the time and to humble yourself because that happens in athletics as well. And something that was key to my success in sports and also in school and my physical therapy degree is just to have fun and to enjoy the journey. And to enjoy the process because we’re gonna have ups and downs. We’re gonna have failures, we’re gonna have successes. If we see every failure and every success as an opportunity to learn, but also as a part of our journey and an important piece to our journey and into becoming who we’re really meant to be. It is all really important to.
I just encourage every single athlete and anybody in any hard time to look for the little glimpses of light. The little glimpses of hope in every single situation. And so, when you fail a test or when you know height, or when you have a bad performance or you go to nationals and don’t perform as well as you wanted to, having the ability to be humbled by that experience, but using it for good and using it for something to learn from rather than letting it tear you down is gonna be something that is gonna help a lot of people. So always getting back up on your feet and learning something from those situations. So, yeah.
Dr. Fick: Andrea, can you tell us what your career goals and aspirations are as a physical therapist?
Andrea: Yeah, I alluded to it a little bit earlier in our discussion, but really I just want to help people and I want to help people, not just make people better physically, but I want to help heal people through the mind, body, and spirit. I want people to be my patient and to say that they had a good experience and that they were transformed, or that they were changed in some way because of the way that we treated them. And I think something that also occurred in my injury. I talked to a few previous coaches when I got injured from high school and this was part of my psychological journey, but in a way, I had to write some letters of forgiveness and just really reach out to people because I had this, I guess, expectation on myself that I was going to be one of the best pole vaulters in the world, that I was gonna be this really high level professional pole vaulter.
And something that this coach specifically said is Andrea, at the end of the day, at the end of our lives, people aren’t gonna remember you by the things that you did or all the trophies you have or all the medals you’ve won, but your character, but by your character and how you have treated people and how you’ve made an impact. And so I just, what my biggest goal really in life is to just be a light for the Lord and to glorify him in everything that I’m doing. And to just help people with all that I am. So thank you.
Dr. Fick: That’s fantastic. I wondered what your perspective was. You know, you did a clinical rotation with us this summer. We so appreciated having you here. It was awesome. And I just wanted to share perspective on, in the way that we treat patients, how were you able to learn and grow as a student physical therapist in our practice? How were you able to accomplish some of those goals here at Fick Physical Therapy and Sports Performance?
Andrea: Yeah, of course. I think one of the things that attracted me so much to Fick Physical Therapy when I was going through the interview process for my rotations was the mission of Fick Physical Therapy, but also the ability to have one-on-one care and to have a cash pay clinic. I think that creates so much potential and so much availability because being one-on-one with a patient helps us with that practitioner patient rapport. And when we have that connection, we develop that connection and we help these people and we have the freedom to do so. That is, I think, one of the biggest aspects. And then also, talking about the mission, who you guys are is getting people back as quickly and as safely as possible. And me being an athlete, I just valued that aspect of your guys’ goals and missions so much because we wanna be back as quick as possible. But if it’s not safe, then there’s risk for re-injury.
And so, I think that you guys, what I’ve seen is you guys care and you guys go above and beyond what really what I’ve seen any other clinic does in order to make sure that your patients are loved and make sure that your patients are cared about. And I saw Gina working extra hours, after hours, always answering texts to make sure that her patients are cared for. And I just, that’s what I really value about you and what you’ve created in your business. And yeah, you just really created something where you really love and care about who you treat. And I think that’s also something that sets you apart. They’re not just your patients, but they’re people too.
Dr. Fick: Absolutely, and that’s really the mission and the reason, the why behind what we do. And thank you for being a part of that. Andrea, we really appreciate having you here and I know our patients are asking now about you and how you’re doing and really you, so yeah, that was awesome. Just to wrap up, I wondered if you could give our student athletes one piece of advice. We’re handling adversity and challenges, what would that be?
Andrea: One piece of advice, I would say using your adversity and your challenges for good. I know that that is kind of non-traditional and what a lot of people would not say, but there is light and there is good in every situation. So something that really was beneficial for me in seeing that because I went through some depression during my injury and it was really, it really took over who I was as a person and I started to define myself as my failure. I saw my injury as a failure, and I started to define myself as my injury. So what my sports psychologist Dr. Mary Fry really challenged me to do was to express gratitude to the people around me. And once I started to shift my injury and what was going on, once I started to shift my energy and my focus off of myself and onto other people, it really gave me a lot of freedom.
And so I think there are a lot of aspects about adversity and injuries that we cannot control and that we will never be able to control. And so shifting your focus off of yourself and becoming selfless, expressing gratitude, being kind to others, and being the very best teammate person, brother, sister, student that you possibly can be. That’s what’s gonna bring you out of adversity, and that’s what’s gonna really open your eyes up to a whole new perspective on what your injury or what your struggle, or what your failure or your adversity could be.
Dr. Fick: Thank you, Andrea. Yeah, I think that is such excellent advice and you are going to be such a gift to the physical therapy world. I mean, I talked to you before you went to PT school. I think I wrote a letter of recommendation for you because I saw your potential and I actually got a contract, you know, with Emory University in the hopes that one day, you and your classmates could do clinical rotations here with us. And you’ve been such a gift in my life and in the life of our clients and patients and coworkers here. And we wish you the very best as you finish out your school career here and graduate soon. We hope this podcast has been very helpful for our listeners. I think it’s been really, really valuable perspective and advice and we just thank you so much, Andrea, for being a part of this show today and we look forward to talking with you more in the future and best of luck to you as you graduate.
Andrea: Yes, of course. It really is an honor. I miss you guys.
Dr. Fick: We miss you a lot too. Thank you.